“Suicidal glory is the luxury of the irresponsible. We're not giving up. We're waiting for a better opportunity to win.”
" I don't think I've ever met a Liberal whom I didn't like on a personal basis. That said, if your goal is to change minds and influence people, it's probably not a good idea to begin by asserting that virtually all elected Democrats are liars. But what the hell."
drives me nuts, and nobody has ever given me an adequate explanation
for it. A priest takes a vow of celibacy. WTF difference
does it make whether the priest experiences occasional sexual feeling
for men, or women, as long as they are controlled, and the vow is
observed? Is the Vatican saying that homosexual urges are
uncontrollable? This is not the military. Priests are not
forced to share bath facilities, where a heterosexual male might
very well feel uncomfortable. WTF? Any viable explanation
"I did not vote for Obama but he is remarkable. In less than three
weeks in office he has collected more than $150,000 in back taxes." Gayle Miller
All the molestations that have happened in the catholic church were done by homosexual priests. They have found that the homosexuals do not remain celibate, heck even a few of the straight ones get it regularly. Back in the 70's they had the same attitude as you, and molestations sky rocketed.
According to several aritcles my husband has read,(raised Cathlolic) the Catholic Church of America, actively recruited homosexuals for the priesthood in the 1970's. And the rest is posted by Anonymous. I don't think any studies were performed, Rodger. It was a matter of a shortage of available men for the job, and you know women are not allowed. joyce
A great many homosexuals were in the priesthood LONG before the 1970's. And, I am neither defending, nor condemning that lifestyle ... this is about coming to terms with something I don't get. The problem is pedophilia, anyway. Are there data that show a higher incidence of pedophiles among the gay population? Are there data that show a higher incidence of violating a vow of chastity among gays? I'm open, but in the absence of studies more accurate than say those we get on Global Warming, I have to wonder what this will accomplish, aside from exacerbating a shortage of priests problem.
I already had this discussion w/my husband, questioning how gay translated to pedophilia, which is the ugly problem that has surfaced and been dismissed so many times over the years. But I don't think that is the issue here.
IMHO, Rodger, it is more related to conservative Christian values, and possibly the general fear w/in The Vatican that: 1st gays, then women. FWIW, joyce
Rodger, I agree with you that the problem is really with priests just not keeping their vows. But Tammy Bruce writes in The Death of Right and Wrong that a growing subset of the gay community, ephebophiles, are specifically attracted to adolescent boys and tend to seek out jobs that grant them private access to boys. It's a growing problem, mainly because the spread of AIDS and other STDs makes younger, obviously untouched "partners" more and more appealing to them. So, a certain number of priests (fortunately, still a small number) really are just in it for sex, and go in with no intention of keeping their vows.
The Church's stance really is just intended to stop molestation before it happens. Priests have about the same amount of private access to young girls, but an overwhelming majority of the victims of this sort of molestation are boys. So, unfortunately, a mildly discriminatory hiring practice does appear to be the best option for the Church.
To clarify things a bit: most those abused were teen-age males. So I don't know if you strictly classify that as pedeophilia. It's ephebophilia.
Yes, there are priests that are and have been homosexual and celibate. Yes, there are and have been priests that are heterosexual and not celibate. I've known both types. Been that way for ages.
The problem is that things have gotten out of control. And the seminaries, especially the ones in the U.S., are a large part of the problem. It's the equivalent of the LAPD police academy being run by street gangs.
Since the U.S. bishops won't or can't handle it, the Vatican is essentially cleaning house.
The foundation of my comment first and foremost is Jesus was God. "He became flesh and dwelt among us" Johns Gospel. God shaped us and formed us and certainly knows how his creation 'works'. Jesus said that clebacy was a 'gift' and that anyone considering a ministry postition should not 'go' but be 'called'. There was never a edit from Christ tht said ministers were to be single. Look at the Apostles.
There are a multiplicity of motives why these men 'go' but they really need to know if they have the gift of celebacy as the Catholic Church puts on these men. Now if you want to talk about Protestant protocol, they are more realistic:they permit a man to marry. Its purely OK. There are many Husband/Wife ministry teams. There is also a equal amount of divorce in the church as well as the secular society. Thats another subject.
However, homosexualty is a choice. There are no genes or DNA, its a choice. And men who go into the ministry as Catholics know what is required of them. Its a stretch for most. Hey GUYs, can we talk?!
Google these terms: data study gay pedophilia. Unless the site has to do with psycology or psycologists, who've been trying to normalize pedophilia for the past few years, it is obvious that gay men molest children more often per capita than heterosexual men. I agree with the church. No gay priests or scout masters!
Well, I'm not Catholic, but let's give it a shot. Homosexuality is a sinful condition. Whether inborn or a choice, a homosexual has a problem. Under most of Christianity Homosexuality is not a socially or morally acceptible situation. Neither is bachelorhood (speaking as a long time bachelor). Believers must either work out their homosexuality, or leave.
Catholocism gives the homosexual believer a third option. He can become a priest, and not deal with the problem, but if indeed there IS a psychological or spiritual disease in that person, merely hiding it is not going to fix it.
Indeed, it is possible that the Catholic priesthood is particularly attractive to homosexual catholics for just that reason. It seems easier than working out the problem, and nearly everyone everywhere will nearly always take the easy way out.